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MikeONeill wrote:Firstly I see a lot of the commentary is from people who have joined this Forum since Feb 11. So clearly not routine Red Gate users, and do not contribute to the community with experiences from the use of Red Gate products and involvement in Beta Testing etc. They just join up to moan...MikeONeill wrote:As a community are we getting too used to freebies, after all as professional developers how often to we work on a project and "Give it away" , I suspect not too often , we are all in it for the money so why should not a commercial operation like Red Gate take the same approach.
Greets Mike,
I couldn't agree more! I highlighted a couple points in your post to point out that: a) I didn't sign up to the forums until recently; and b) professional developers should not be used to getting free tools that deserve compensation.
There are a lot of stand-alone tools which are free or require some fee to unlock their full potential. I have quite a few that I've obtained for my tool-chest and have recently purchased the .NET tools from Red Gate to assist even more with the development process.
It was actually the notice that Red Gate was going to charge for Reflector that made me decide to go ahead and purchase their other products along with it. There have been at least 4 times that I have used Reflector in order to find bugs in framework code, third-party code or verify that an assembly in production contained the same code as the binaries on a build machine. However, I was definitely in need of some good .NET profiling tools and Red Gate seems to have the best on the market. -
Not regular Red Gate users? Of course we're not.
For what we are is regular Reflector users. I've been using Reflector since at least 2005, well before Lutz Roeder sold it to Red Gate. Reflector has always been free, and Red Gate pledged to keep it free when they bought it. Now they tell us they lied.
Leaving that aside, what improvements have they made to Reflector? They're asking us to pay for Reflector 7 Basic, but it's not clear to me that they've done anything with it since August 2008. (In fact, I asked a question about that on these forums, and they seem to have ignored it.) It appears as though we're being asked to pay $35 for...nothing, other than the ability to keep using a tool we've already been using. Who wouldn't bristle at that? -
Firstly I see a lot of the commentary is from people who have joined this Forum since Feb 11. So clearly not routine Red Gate users, and do not contribute to the community with experiences from the use of Red Gate products and involvement in Beta Testing etc. They just join up to moan...
I take slight offense to this comment. I have been a Reflector user for years before Redgate purchased it, and have probably used it far longer than you have. Just because I have not been actively involved in this community does not mean I have absolutely no right to an opinion on this matter. Since this happens to be the only way to voice my concern over this turn of events, I'm damn well going to voice my concern!
You seem interested in Redgate's other products. You're more than welcome to. I am not. I have not had a reason to use any product aside from Reflector and there's not much to discuss on that alone. Why I would need to join this community and participate in order to be allowed an opinion on a piece of software I've used for several years is asinine. -
MikeONeill wrote:... how often to we work on a project and "Give it away" ...
Even if we don't give our own work away for nothing, the fact remains that RedGate did give Reflector v6 away as a free tool. I don't have a problem with them charging for the new version, but trying to retroactively apply that charge to all v6 users is totally unacceptable.
If you did decide to work for a charity in your spare time as a volunteer, I doubt they'd be too happy if you turned up six months later and demanded payment for your "free" work!
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I have been a Red Gate user now for 4 Years + using mainly SQL Prompt . I adopted Red Gate when the previous developers "Sold Out" to Red Gate. If Reflector improves at the pace of Prompt SQL (SQL Prompts predecessor) it will be a trully awesome product going forward.
For example , SQL Refactor seemed like a good idea , but I suspect not may people bought it, I even let my support lapse , but still had the use of it . In the new V5 SQL Prompt Pro its all there and for NO EXTRA cost, so I now effectively have it Thrown In.
I have to admit I have a Reflctor Pro license ,with support so this is not going to cost me anything extra , I have "payed for what I see as a valuable tool"
As a community are we getting too used to freebies, after all as professional developers how often to we work on a project and "Give it away" , I suspect not too often , we are all in it for the money so why should not a commercial operation like Red Gate take the same approach.
Don't get me wrong , I like freebies like the next guy , but when its time to cough up, so be it .
I like the Red Gate approach to allow freebies like SQL Search , to test the water , we get the advantage , they get the "Market Research" seems fair to me.
Get a cracked version maybe but I do hope you get one with more than you bargained for.
Software isn't cheap , but if you get what you want and these tools are simply that they add to ease of your daily development effort , I for one cannot use a PC without SQL prompt installed , I try typing ssf and nothing happens. I cannot estimate how much time it has saved me since I installed it
Finally , I must admit its maybe not Red Gates smartest PR move , but I can see their commercial reasoning and I suspect when the fuss dies down I hope a few of the naysayers may come around. Red Gate produces excellent tools and they are massive tiome saves , persuade yourself to admit it . :lol:
Mike